Project Orbitos

[chovynz]

Name: Project Orbitos

Game Type: Free for all (in Space!)

Map Size: 32 x 32 up to 128 x 128

Players: 2-12 (more fun with 12)

Objective: Destroy your opponents base while defending your own.

Whos involved?
[del]Peon[/del] Ranking Brigade Commander Long-Ass-Name - chovynz
Weapons Master Chief - Master Maste
Systems Checker Specialist - Ectonalunarios - Has fallen off the edge of the world...if someone spots him could you let him know we're almost done?



Brief Plot:
Humans, Orcs, the Undead and a few new races have not stopped fighting. Tens of thousands of years have passed and the races are still battling it out, only now they have spacecraft. A moon has been discovered with deposits of Tyranium - a newly discovered alloy used to make pinball balls. Unfortunatly (for you,) the other races have found it too! They have set up a base on the other side of the moon and wish to mine the moon of Tyranium for themselves. Destroy their base so you can have full access to the moon, to the Tyranium under the surface and over the pinball machines of the galaxy!



Description:
You're in space! You have 1 base and 1 unit. 12 players are able to join. The action centers around a small moon and the opponents ships and bases. Take out the enemy ships, destroy the enemy bases and win.



Gameplay:
This is supposed to be a fun almost-click-fest in Warcraft3 style. 12 players, 12 starting bases, 12 units. Fast gameplay, click or point and shoot, area of effect payloads, weapon and shield upgrades, anti base-camping systems, possible gravity wells.

I'm planning of having line of sight. Because you're in space you should be able to see quite far, but obviously you won't be able to see through the moon. There may be a radar of some description that you can buy later at your base. So far we haven't been very successful with having line of sight work correctly, so for the pre_alpha release we are having no fog and no black mask. If anyone has any ideas or suggestions feel free to post.

Has anyone played Star Control or The Ur-Quan Masters? I just realised my mod idea is quite similar to the melee mode of that game. So you could think of Project Orbitos as Star Control with some additions in the WC3 engine.



Cameras:
I think it would be quite nice to be able to have 3rd person perspective, a normal WC3 view and a zoomed out feature.



Races:
I intend on using these races and the players can select one of them using dialogs:
Human
Human (Pirate faction)
Orcs
Elves
Undead
Naga
Trolls
Ogres
Zerg
Protoss
Species
01001111

The races will have color coded bases, units, weapons, shields etc. This is so you can tell at a glance who is shooting at you. The effects of explosions, weapons and shields that a unit has will be the players color. I do not intend on using vertex coloring if I can help it.

Races to be added at a later date. For the pre_alpha release we are only having human.



Weapons:
As of some time in the past I've thought of these weapons I'd like included in this map:
Lasers - Auto Targeting, Direct line firing
Small projectiles of some description, Single shot, Gatling Guns, Long Range, Tracers?, Homing Bullets
Rockets, Magnetic Accelerator Cannons, Mass Drivers, Homing Missiles, Guided Missiles?, Salvos
Ion, Single shot, Multi Directional, Flowing, Partical Cannons
Mines - Friend or Foe, Proximity, Homing, Stealth, Acid, Other
Area of effect - Acid cloud, Nuke, Plasma, Radiation, Flashbangs, ChronoGrip (time ability)



Shields:
Appropriate shields to the various weapons. Shields usually refer to something physical, but energy shields are also added to these. However as I noted somewhere, there will be a limited amount of items able to be carried. (Names to be decided - the following names describe their function more than it's final name.)
Anti-Laser shields
Anti-Projectile
Extra Plating against rockets / missles
Magnetic Shields against plasma
Anti time items



Weapon & Shield Interaction:
The concepts for the weapon systems and shields are as follows.

The first is the weapons. This is simple. Fire at an enemy, if they are not shielded appropriatly - they take damage. The weapons have different types of attacks so you need different defense against them. There is energy (in the form of heat or cold heat i.e. lightening), projectile, magnetic, or some others.

The second concept is passive defense. Fire at an enemy with a laser. If they have an absorption anti-laser shield, the shield takes the damage and will recharge. The shield will absorb up to a certain amount of damage then fail, leaving the protected ship, vulnerable to attack.

The third concept is aggressive defense turning a defense into a form of attack. Sticking with the laser example, when you fire at an enemy and your opponent has a reflective shield the laser has a chance of bouncing back and hitting you! Taking this concept further, when the enemy upgrades a reflective shield they may have the ability to direct the reflection. For example they could (potentially) direct your laser shot at them...towards another player nearby or back at yourself.



The two defensive concepts in detail:
#1 - "Weapon - Anti Weapon" Passive Defense:

Direct Line Firing Lasers - Absorption Shield, Diffusion Shields
Auto Targeting Lasers - Absorption Shield, Diffusion Shields

Single shot projectiles - Armoured Plating (basically adds to your hp)
Gatling Guns - Armoured Plating, Plasma Sheilds
Long Range - Armoured Plating, Plasma Sheilds
Tracers - Armoured Plating, Plasma Sheilds
Homing Bullets - Armoured Plating, Plasma Sheilds

Rockets - Armoured Plating
Magnetic Accelerator Cannon - Armoured Plating (not that it would DO much against a MAC)
Mass Driver - Armoured Plating
Missiles (fast versions of the rockets and will target nearest random enemy) - Armoured Plating
Homing Missiles (Faster, targeted onto one specified enemy) - Armoured Plating
Guided Missiles (medium speed, guided) - Armoured Plating
Salvos - Armoured Plating

(note: I've done some research on plasma. And removed Plasma from the direct line weapons, changing plasma to Ions instead.Plasma will still be used as a weapon, just not the projectile shots.)
Single Ion shot - Recombination Shield
Multi Directional Ion - Recombination Shield
Flowing Ion Targeted Stream- Recombination Shield
Partical Cannon - Recombination Shield (but the PC having a bigger burst will give more damage)

Defense against mines depends whats IN the mines.
Friend or Foe Mines - Armoured Plating
Proximity Mines - Armoured Plating
Homing Mines - Armoured Plating
Stealth Mines? - Armoured Plating
Acid Mines - Plasma Shields
other

Acid cloud - Water Containment Shield
Nuke - DeFusional Shield
Gamma Radiation - DeFusional Shield
Flashbangs - Polarized HUD




#2 "Weapon - Anti Weapon" Aggressive Defense:
Direct Line Firing Lasers - Reflection Shield
Auto Targeting Lasers - Reflection Shield

Single shot projectiles - Projectile Net
Gatling Guns - Projectile Net
Long Range - Projectile Net
Tracers - ??
Homing Bullets - ??

Rockets - ??
Magnetic Accelerator Cannon - ??
Mass Driver - ??
Missiles (fast versions of the rockets and will target nearest random enemy) - Missile Overide Source System
Homing Missiles (Faster, targeted onto one specified enemy) - Missile Overide Source System
Guided Missiles (medium speed, guided) - Missile Overide Source System
Salvos - Missile Overide Source System

Single Ion shot - Ion Collector
Multi Directional Ion - Ion Collector
Flowing Ion Targeted Stream - Ion Collector
Partical Cannon - Partical Collector

Defense against mines depends what's IN the mines.
Friend or Foe Mines - Disarming & Retrieval Kit
Proximity Mines - Disarming & Retrieval Kit
Homing Mines - Disarming & Retrieval Kit
Stealth Mines? - Detection & Disarming Kit (no more stealth. Just a normal mine)
Acid Mines - Disarming & Retrieval Kit

Acid cloud - ??
Nuke - ??
Plasma - ??
Gamma Radiation - ??
Flashbangs - ??



Counter Measures:
These aren't really Shields, but methods for destroying or counteracting the weapon.

Direct Line Firing Lasers - ??
Auto Targeting Lasers - Anti Targeting Counter Measures (Makes it unable to lock onto you)

Single shot projectiles - Defense Grid
Gatling Guns - Defense Grid
Long Range - Defense Grid
Tracers - Advanced Defense Grid
Homing Bullets - Advanced Defense Grid

Rockets - Chaff
Magnetic Accelerator Cannon - ??
Mass Driver - ??
Missiles (fast versions of the rockets and will target nearest random enemy) - ECM
Homing Missiles (Faster, targeted onto one specified enemy) - ECM
Guided Missiles (medium speed, guided) - ECM
Salvos - Advanced ECM

Single Ion shot - ??
Multi Directional Ion - ??
Flowing Ion Targeted Stream - Anti Targeting Counter Measures
Partical Cannon - ??

Defense against mines depends what's IN the mines.
Friend or Foe Mines - IFF Signal Swap
Proximity Mines - Mine Detector
Homing Mines - Anti Targeting Counter Measures
Stealth Mines? - ??
Acid Mines - ??

Acid cloud - Water Containment Shield
Nuke - ??
Gamma Radiation - ??
Plasma - ??
Flashbangs - Polarized HUD



Unit Mods:
HyperDive (upgradeable to 5 levels) makes your unit go faster
Warp Engine (upgradeable to 5 levels) can warp to a random point. Later lvls can warp to a selected point ( - kind of like blink I guess).
Shields (upgradable to 5 levels) gives you more max mana.
Hull (upgradable to 5 levels) gives you more max hp
Power Couplings (upgradeable) faster fire rate

I'm thinking only a limited amount of mods to a ship so you have to play strategically. Defensively or agressively? Up to you. But there will be a counter for every attack / defense.



Technical:
When you destroy a unit this is what happens:

• The dead unit drops scrap metal
• Or the dead unit drops an item

You can sell the scrap metal at your base for a little money or you can pick up the item which may be one of these:

• engine upgrades
• weapon upgrades
• new weapons
• batteries for your shields (mana)
• armor plating (to repair your hull (hp))
• other

Note: The item drops, so other players CAN pick it up! Be quick to collect your loot.



Bases:
Bases will be your starting point and your spawning point. You can upgrade your ship's engines, weapons and shields here. (I'm playing with the idea of having to dock to upgrade rather than being able to just click on an icon when your halfway across the map.)

The bases will feature an anti camping system. You must be inside your base or have no unit on the field (i.e. dead) to use it. With a low cool-down time you can spam the area of your base so you can exit your base safely. The ABC system will go out expanding from your base to a limited range. This will either destroy or knock an enemy far away. It will not however, give any bonus if the enemy is destroyed. This limitation is to prevent players from camping in their own base and being able to destroy other players units by spamming AND getting a reward for it.

The Base may be able to attack. I haven't decided this yet.

You can construct another ship here once your unit is destroyed. (There may be additional ships to choose from - scouts, heavy weapon ships, heavy shielded ships etc. - For a future date and release.)

The Bases will be placed on a circular starting point out from the center of the moon, but will be randomised in that circle. See picture for an explanation. The bases will also slowly orbit around the moon in a clockwise fashion. This is to keep it interesting when you are out in the field! You need to find your base urgently, and you find its moved to the other side of the map?? Oh No! Should've paid attention.


The base rotation will be for a future release as we are concentrating on getting the systems to work. Base orbiting (which is where the name comes from btw) is a gimmick and as such can wait until we have a good working game already.

Moon:
Well, this is pretty easy actually. Random models of certain selection. Every model I use will need to be scaled up, but everytime you play the map its a different moon. 1 match it could be a rock, another an Infernal birth, another a barrel! Who knows? I might even use a wisp! Again, for a future release. There are some conflicts between using a doodad moon and a unit moon, so we'll keep you posted on this. For the pre-alpha we're only using a single non changing doodad moon.



Controls:
[del]I'm playing around with the idea of using keyboard controls (WASD + fire - or up down left right + fire). Can people give me comments on which control system is better and why? Give me opinions of other WC3 games you have played with keys or mouse. (Keyboard controls ARE multiplayable correct?)[/de] Standard controls, with arrow key or WASD to be decided later.



Comments:
[del]I think the plot is lame. Its really just an excuse to make a map like this. If anyone can come up with a better plot I'd appreciate it.[/del] Plotlines may be individual depending on race - for a future release. Credits will be given for anything used which I have not personally done. (This does not include tutorials I have learned from, though I may mention them.)

 

[Quauhtli]

I like the idea
And maybe you can just change the plot a little that it's like the Starcraft guys have found Warcraft guys and taken them into space where they all fight over the moon....:nuts:
lol
ah well...
still i like the idea
+rep

 

[Geelottaja]

Sounds nice. How far have you gotten yet?

 

[chovynz]

Not much to be honest. I want to plan it out properly before starting the coding. I've found it really helps when I have a project to plan plan plan! then do something. And once I get started on the coding / terraining I'm doing it to a plan (subject to change constantly! )

The plan holds me together while I'm so off-track-tangentally-oriented. You could say I'm plannely-challenged. Or just easily distracted.

In any case I have come up with a few in depth concepts for weapons and defense. See above for the ideas. I'll be adding to the first post as I go so watch that space!

Please! give me more comments! More suggestions! Tell me if you think the idea of anything I present suxs!

 

[master maste]

1) liked the idea of space ships around the moon etc
2) think that using AOE spells for attacks would be cool.
3) I would like to test/ help on any work that I can.

 

[Lunarios]

Hmmmmm...

So the moons just a peice of the background, correct?

If this battle were real (Russians and the U.S?) than the moon would hold much more strategetic importance. Factions would place all kinds of things on the moon. I suggest two ways of doing this.

1. Use the moon as a unit, which you can put items into, with the phoneix fire ability. When a unit gets close enough to the moon, they get control of the unit.

2. The moon is a small dab of terrain, and you place turrets on it. The terrain could chance every game, and there would be a control becon at the center of the moon.

Effectively, you could make anything on the moon. Repair base, respawner. Most of this could be done via items.

What do you think?

 

[chovynz]

1) liked the idea of space ships around the moon etc
2) think that using AOE spells for attacks would be cool.
3) I would like to test/ help on any work that I can.

Thank you! I'll keep that in mind. What can you do? What's your strong points in map making? Whats your weak points?

Hmmmmm...

So the moons just a peice of the background, correct?

Nope, the moon is a unit, scaled up. Otherwise the background, would have to be imported, and i have a sneaky thought that I'll need as much space as possible. I'm already planning on importing backgrounds and in later versions of the game, models and skins. I think a scaled up unit for the moon is the best way to go with line of site. Plus I want the gameplay to go AROUND the moon.

If this battle were real (Russians and the U.S?) than the moon would hold much more strategetic importance. Factions would place all kinds of things on the moon. I suggest two ways of doing this.

1. Use the moon as a unit, which you can put items into, with the phoneix fire ability. When a unit gets close enough to the moon, they get control of the unit.

2. The moon is a small dab of terrain, and you place turrets on it. The terrain could chance every game, and there would be a control becon at the center of the moon.

Effectively, you could make anything on the moon. Repair base, respawner. Most of this could be done via items.

What do you think?

Hmm....interesting thoughts. I'll think about them and see if they fit into what I'm trying to do. Thanks for your feedback!

 

[chovynz]

Progress Update:

Well I've started making PRoject: Orbitos now. My CD Rack is broken so I went around to a friends house to use their computer. Funny enough, he suggested the same idea as Lunarios did (up there^). So I definatly have to think on that more.

The moon is created! For the moment I'm going to leave it as it is, a single unit blown up to 3000% of its normal size. It's there and it works. Because it's blown up so big, it looks a little ugly (well - alot ugly). I've added locust to the moon so it is "invisible" - that is, you can't click it or impact it, but you can see it. I've used the model of, um, I forgot. Its a spinning hunk of rock that is used by some hero as a projectile. It emits green gas or something noxious. Anyway the model is found under projectiles. The green gas is a nice touch, and I like the idea, but I'm not too happy with the texture looking the way it is.

I've added path blockers so that you cant go through it. And I've also added line of sight blockers which works quite well.

If I want to in the future I know how to make random buildings using these models, so it CAN be different each time. But like I said at the top, for the moment I'll leave it as is. I want to get the systems in place before adding things like random buildings or custom models for the ships.

I've been playing around with the ship movement speed and I think I've come across a nice speed. However I'm having difficulty getting past the limit for:

• Max movement speed
• & Max visibility

Yes I've done the shift click thing and the values do change to my inputted values in the object editor. The problem I'm having is, they dont seem to GO much faster. I didn't notice much speed difference between 520 and 999. So I'll have a play around there. I've taken a look in Gameplay constants, but I didn't really see anything that looked useful to visibility limits. I thought about putting invisible dummy units that emit visibility around the map, but that negates the line of sight blockers in the moon. And if I turn fog of war off, the line of sight blockers dont have anything to block with.

The terraining is going to be easy, plus I need to see what I'm doing WITH the terrain. I'm going to leave the terrain till last, as I'll be turning it off mostly.

Next thing I'm going to try is the first weapon trigger. After that I'll try the anti weapon / sheild. Sorry I dont have any thing for you to see - my friend didn't have a net connection and I didn't take a flashdrive. (Isn't much to see anyway...

 

[master maste]

sorry it took so long to get back to you just going through exams.

strong points- are triggering
- ideas
weak points- terraining

hope you are still going on with this idea, as it sounds really fun.
If you have no idea what you are going to do with the ground texture I have a few ideas up my sleave <----- I messed up the spelling I can tell. lol

 

[chovynz]

Oh I'm definitaly carrying on on this project.

And, in all honesty I think I'm quite capable of doing the whole thing! But don't take that as a refusal. It'd just take me longer to do by myself...if you know what I mean. Ok now that I've put my foot in it I'm gonna stop .

Your help will be greatly appreciated Master .

My strengths are terraining, but like I said on the main part, I think the terraining will be the easiest thing to do.

Let's hear your ideas about the terrain.

This is what I have planned.

• I'll make a trigger that makes the ground random
• Set all units to flying, so they follow the contours of the terrain
• I'll create a custom tile
• Tile will have an alpha channel - in the wrong places - so the terrain will be invisible
• Dot up to 100 - 200 sparkly doodads around the place so it looks like you're in space.

Slightly OT: Having my CD Rack broken is a real pain. I can't test any maps, or look at any ideas at home. I have a warranty on my computer so they can fix it once I bring it in, but I can't do that just yet, because They have to send it away for 7-10 days and I'm still doing some graphic design jobs that have a deadline soon. But until the rack is fixed, no writing CDs, no playing any more music, no playing any game that requires a CD, no map editing!!! Darned frustrating!

I could fix it myself for crying out loud, but I want to use the warranty! /rant

On topic again:
Master, I have a request of triggers for you. Could you try this?
Homing Bullets: What I imagine when I say HB, is a tiny white "bullet" that homes on an enemy.

The first and most simple idea for this is a single shot homing bullet.
Cooldown time of 1 sec. (We can balance it later if need be.)
No arrow models! This is in space! (Plus, we might be adding models later.)
No leaks if you can manage it. If not, we can look at it later.
Speed: Fairly fast. It should be difficult to dodge but have a medium turning rate.

<Shrug> I guess thats it. Feel free to IM me. I'm intending on keeping this project open - as in everyone can see the triggers and whatnot. Hopefully someone else will learn from what we do (as we do when we work on a map) And if we need to optimize the map we'll consider it as a team (whoever is on the team at that time)

Posting results on here would be nice to keep it all in one place and for the development process - for anyone who's interested.

Oh yes; Welcome aboard Weapons Master Chief Master Maste!

 

[master maste]

my terrain ideas were similar, except there would be a doodad based on a bush with a black elevator model. the problem with this is that all units have to be flying, and you can't see items.
So you false alpha channel thing would work better.

I was also thinking about using sparkly things all over the map, but maybe making a trigger for it so that it randomly creates "stars" all over the map (a peon with the far seer projectile).

I will start working on the triggered ability straight away. Is there any ability you want it to be based on . . .

like the new name "Weapons Master Chief Master Maste!"

 

[chovynz]

my terrain ideas were similar, except there would be a doodad based on a bush with a black elevator model. the problem with this is that all units have to be flying, and you can't see items.
So you false alpha channel thing would work better.

I was also thinking about using sparkly things all over the map, but maybe making a trigger for it so that it randomly creates "stars" all over the map (a peon with the far seer projectile).

I like that idea. .....Maybe....I also like the idea of placings stars where we need them. If it were random

• we'd need to remove each randomly made point
• we can't put recognisable constellations in the sky

Dummy units. Invisible dummy units with a sparkly model. Scaled and sized. Little and big. Lots of variation. Different colours would be nice. Hmmmm I need to think about this.

I think actually placing them wouldn't take up to much space (lol pun), so I'd kinda prefer putting them where we want rather than random.

Although...yeah i need to think about this more.

I will start working on the triggered ability straight away. Is there any ability you want it to be based on . . .

None that I can think of. It's really just a simple projectile spell. Homing - but dodgeable. (So basing it on forked lightning wouldn't be good )

like the new name "Weapons Master Chief Master Maste!"

 

[master maste]

working on the test run now, wont be too long till the basic thing is set up.
Thinking of adding some cool effects to make it not so ordinary.
Probably wont be done tonight but I will keep you posted.

Edit: alright I've done some testing and I have something very good.
I'll post it here as soon as possible ok

 

[master maste]

Heres what I have come up with.
Like it like it is/want some changes then just ask.

edit: oops sorry I didn't realise I was double posting.
(is there anyway to delete a double posted post?)

 

[chovynz]

Thanks for your work on it.

Personally I dont mind double posts if they are useful. Both yours are. I don't know how the mods will look at it in a members project thread though.

I'll check out the map sometime later. (I need to arrange a time with my friend to use his comp.)
I'm thinking just leaving it simple at this stage would be good. It's the second most basic bullet, so I think it should be plain. But not having seen it... well I'll let you know what I think. Thanks again.

 

[master maste]

got an exam tomorrow morning but after that I will work on fixing up the "homing bullet" trigger as it still has many more things that need to be improved. . .

Also I got a bit carried away with trying another spell and with custom unit models lol. . .

may I suggest changing the name from "Homing Bullet" to "Homing Rocket" or "Homing Missile" as it would give it a more futuristic sound (bullets sound a bit. . . modern )

 

[chovynz]

got an exam tomorrow morning but after that I will work on fixing up the "homing bullet" trigger as it still has many more things that need to be improved. . .

Also I got a bit carried away with trying another spell and with custom unit models lol. . .

may I suggest changing the name from "Homing Bullet" to "Homing Rocket" or "Homing Missile" as it would give it a more futuristic sound (bullets sound a bit. . . modern )

Thats really good work! Thanks. And yes you did get carried away but that's often how we map makers work isn't it

And no I won't rename it to rocket. Thats another weapon / ability that we'll create based off this one. I wanted to get this one right first so that our work is easier later. Thanks for the suggestion though.

There are a number of issues with the Homing Bullet, and I've fiddled with the map you made. See my map attached for my changes. (Ignore the terrain...I was showing a friend in a minute what the editor is capable off. My friend plays normal Wc3 games, but hasn't touched the editor. Lol you should've seen his face!)

Noticed issues with your version: (I turned off the fog so we can see clearly what's going on. For the moment I also disabled the triggers. There's some useful stuff in there so I'm not dismissing them, just switching them off atm.)

(Your version - my adjustments)
1) Bullet Speed was too slow - adjusted to be much faster
2) Targeting range was far too small - extended the range
3) Target effect moved too slowly - now instantly moves to unit
4) Smoke - disabled smoke for the time being - seemed to be not needed.
5) Homing is good
6) Damage was 100/200/300 - now is 10/15/20 (note: the damage doesn't actually matter at this stage. I just didn't want to kill all the enemies too quickly )
7) Hotkey conflicts - changed from H (button for hold) to Q. Ill explain this later.



Some things: The bullet has been based off Stormbolt. There's a problem with this; Stormbolt has a stun buff that will cancel channeling. I need all projectiles to leave channeling alone. I gave a halfhearted attempt at removing the stun buff / effect but I was focused on other things.



The model for the bullet is too large. Remember this is a bullet, not a rocket. This size would be good to use for the rockets or missiles but not the bullets. I tried a few ways of scaling it down but they didn't work. (And just while I was typing this I suddenly thought I could probably use triggers to scale it down - duh. In fact...this projectile could be the basis of all the bullets / missiles and the effects are different because of the triggers. Hmm...i need to think about that.)



Good use of dummy units.

I like the idea of that "Target" art. While playing your map I thought it would be very cool to see your ship suddenly targeted by an enemy, possibly throwing you into a panic. Good work and good idea on that one. Only thing I've done for that at this stage is made it target instantly rather than move towards the targeted unit. I've also turned that "Target" trigger off cause it was distracting me from seeing what the bullet was doing. But I do like it and would like to see something like that in the final version of Project: Orbitos. A couple of final things about that "Target"; I think it needs to follow the targeted unit. While playing I found that if the targeted unit moved, then "Target" stayed in the position of where the targeted unit was last at. I'm thinking a special effect attached to the origin of the targeted unit would be better. That way it follows the unit and then we can destroy the special effect when the bullet hits, without having to rely on any dummy units.

I think it would be good to have the "Target" in the player color of the casting unit. Not just good...I want that.



There's a strange delay on firing the bullet and being able to fire again. I've hunted quite in depth for this one as it was bugging me. I made the bullet cooldown to .2 of a sec, but the long delay is still there. I've set all the timers and triggers that related to the bullet below 1 sec, so it SHOULD have been able to be spammed. But it isn't at the moment. Could this have something to do with Stormbolt? or that stun buff? Or a dummy unit movement speed? I have no idea where that delay is coming from.



Now the Black Hole ability: Sheer GENIUS!
It's awesome! Its a great area effect defense too. Someone caining you? - whip out the can of Black Hole and transport their ass somewhere else. Lol. Love it.

Now, even though I like the idea LOTS (and I mean lots) there are some issues with this one. The primary issue I have with it is the amount of special effects and random points used. In your version the Black Hole stayed alive for a very long time. Which meant any unit that came into its range would be transported to a random point on the map. And it created the teleport effect at that same random point. After a short while of testing the map became crowded with the teleport effects. I really didnt like that.

For one I think that teleport effect is overused. Dota has it. And you know how much THAT map is played. Every other map I've seen that has a teleport uses it. Seriously - its overused. New effect please. Something "cool", maybe a little techy, abstract.

The second thing is the randomness of your trigger. With that length of time, and the amount of possible units entering that Black Hole, (including dummy units I think; I'm not sure if a locusted dummy unit would get affected by the unit in range trigger - if they ARE affected then that makes another issue; what happens when a dummy unit is following an enemy and both enter the black hole?,) that will create quite a few random points which will cause leaks. What happens when 12 players use it? Or 12 players chase each other through the black hole a few times? I'm just thinking in extremes in this case, as I actually think that wouldn't happen much, but you never know.

Hmmm...we need a controlled destroyable random point. Would 10ish x 1mm Regions on a countdown of usage work? Or a quickly patrolling invisible dummy unit? Hmmm...

To Recap:
Homing Bullet: I'd like you to

• Find out where that delay for firing is coming from and make the bullet very quick firing. (Not auto - I'd like most of these projectiles manual for the time being)
• See if you can take the stun off
• Try to make the model smaller...more like a bullet size, but seeable - not too small.
• Make the "Target" follow the targeted unit

Black Hole: Can you

• Make the live time less that what you first had
• Make the area slightly larger
• Change the teleport effect to something else
• Think about a way for controlled randomness

Oh, and I am definitely +repping you. Great work!

 

[master maste]

lol thanks for the advice/crit/praise lol

thanks for the +rep

I'll work on the map, get on to it tonight and on sunday (getting back from Aus then)

lol my maps been dled 5 times

Yea some great ideas posted in there, the black hole was a mess for some reason the triggers to get rid of the effects didn't work and they stayed there (not sure if you noticed but it got hell laggy after about 5mins )
I will concentrate on making this ability work.

Also the homing bullet, I was just gonna make it a normal arrow thing but then you said no arrow, so I changed it to the cannon tower attack.
After playing around for a bit I decided that the (ranged?) aura looked like a target, so I made a dummy unit with the ability and made it play each time. I didn't notice about the dummy unit not moving with the attacking unit because. . . well the pesants didn't move for me lol, but I did notice that the dummy unit didn't quite make it to the target sometimes (want to make a trigger that destorys it when it reaches the target (just got an idea of how I can do that)). All the speeds etc were turned down because I was trying to make it follow the target (didn't work though (though you had a very good idea)).

Well thats enough from me I'm gonna work on those triggers.
any thing else chovynz? (just as I finally breathed after writing that )

 

[chovynz]

Lol

I don't have anything else for you at the moment. Just those things I mentioned up there.

How I like to work is using the K.I.S.S and the measure twice, cut once principles. I don't really care what it (whatever "it" is at that time) looks like, and actually prefer to keep it simple. That way I can get "it" working the way it should and then fiddle with how it looks or the damage or even speed. If you know what I mean. It means the work can look boring at first, but then we can start see it shaping up and getting the bling near the middle / end.

My difficulty is: I know what I want and my challenge is to convey that to another person who's working on my ideas or with me. Effectively you're working with me on my ideas. (And giving me other ideas by what you do, say and produce )

So, can I ask that we hold off on putting effects on for the moment, and concentrate on getting the system working like it should? IDK, Am I being bossy?

By the way, I really do appreciate the work you're doing. I kinda feel a little bad that i can't work on my own triggers and such, while you're plugging away at them. I need to make a time space so I can send my computer away for 7-10 days to get my CD-rack fixed.

 

[master maste]

accident double post my bad