US News States Petition to Secede from the US after Obama Reelection

[Fatmankev]

and my point is having inherent value =/= solving major problems

Right - but you asked what his point was. I was letting you know.

 

[FireCat]

yes - where did you get the 40 states

"Here you go"
Pro-secession requests grow to 40 states.

 

[Varine]

That's how you view it, but it's still officially what the definition would state as a "democracy". If you don't believe in the democracy of your Republic, you're pretty much screwed, since all the other systems out there are worse.

Again... states are democratic to some extent, when it comes to the concern of their local officials and federal representatives. But the federal government, beyond the election of the members of Congress, is out of the hands of the general population... which does not fit the definition of a democracy. Only on a state level, however the states have very little power at this point, and as has been previously noted, heavily reliant on the federal government.

On the school system in the US:

That's because of how your system works, hence the need to fix it. A good system which isn't supplied by private funding wouldn't have good schools escalate further and bad schools sink below ground. Hence, the need to fix it. And no matter how biased the chart is, it's still a system and this is still what generally happened in the US: Educated states voted for Obama and non-educated states voted for Romney. I value education highly, personally, but then again I live in a country where education is available to everyone, regardless of social standing and, most importantly, wealth. Which is far from what is happening in the United States. You blame everything on the government but if you actually gave him more power toward the education system and, again most importantly, means to lower the price of education, the country would come out elevated in the end. And there wouldn't be such imbalance between the States with good and ever-rising schools and states with poor and ever-sinking schools.

How would giving the federal government a larger role in education be beneficial in the end?

The choice is to the people, but for most of them, at least in the US, such a choice isn't given to them. Education fees are way too high and they can't afford it, hence they become fishermen, or anything else, against their own will. You say that the chart is (partially) biased, but that only further proves my point that your education system is flawed. It seems to me like you're trying to say that education yields no meaning, and that's entirely my point: education in your country has minimal meaning, and that has to be looked upon, and by no one else than the Federal government.

Based on that, I take it you have never been down to a lot of these smaller towns in the 'uneducated' areas of the US? Yes, sometimes the barriers retard their ability to do whatever they want later in life, but a large portion of them don't want to leave their hometown, or go far away at any rate. They want to be mechanics or electricians or welders or contractors or career soldiers or whatever else. Many of them DO go to school, though typically it's a trade school or community college, and have no need to complete a bachelor's degree. And that often comes under attack by people as not as worthy as an actual degree, but if that's the case let's see you wire your house or rebuild your automatic transmission.

You said it yourself that schools and colleges are just a series of corporations, and yet you blame the Federal government for it. If your government truly was invested into your education system, as is mine and as is every other educational system in the other top countries in the world, corporations would have minimal role in the system. They would try and recruit those who are finishing and earning a diploma in the months to come.

Again, how would that come about? If we give the government as much control as possible, only good things will come is the message I keep getting and that, at least in the US, has been shown to be wrong many times.

On to your personal experience: I can't help but think you have some sort of hate toward education, which might or might not be the case. I never said that high education meant high intelligence, all I did was pinpoint to statistics that linked states votes with their education levels. Intelligence is independent of education, but along with education comes knowledge, and with knowledge comes a critical mind. There are other means to gather knowledge, but education is the most accessible to the people.

No. I'm going back to school shortly to finish my degree. I have a dislike for the ongoing concept that you're deemed uneducated if you don't go to college. Like you just did.

In the end though, democracy gives each person his own voice. It's up to that person to use it. I don't quite understood if you discredited your democracy or just criticized it, but I still can't manage to understand how someone with low income, low or nonexistent insurance plans, no access to proper healthcare, and living in a broken/wasted flat can vote for a right-wing party. Nothing that party does will help him, except give him easier access to guns so he can rob a bank... But then again, there is no such thing as a center-wing (or even left-wing) party in the United States, so you might just be right that your system isn't entirely democratic. But that's your choice as a sovereign country, and I can only respect that.

Because I don't need the government to hold my hand.

 

[The Helper]

3 pages of talking about secession. Hall of Fame!