PVP Question. (Mage vs Rogue)

[n[u]ll]

Lately I've noticed that the main class that just owns the hell out of me in WSG is rogues. Here's how the usual battle goes with them...

I'm riding along towards the alliance base to capture/help capture the flag when all the sudden I get sapped. Then a second later I'm dead from some burst attack.

At level 45 specd fire, are there any good macros or just moves I should be aware of?

I'm kinda new to the game so you can't expect me to know everything =/

 

[NoxMortus]

At level 45 specd fire

There's your problem. My advice is nova + blink away and find someone else to fight.

 

[n[u]ll]

Lol, I know fire ain't too good for PVP, but it's easier for me to level with (I'm probably going to respec at 70 when I'm satisfied with my gear).

Nova + Blink would work except for the fact that most times this happens, I don't have any time to react because I'm sapped before I can even tell they're there. Then comes some huge crit or ghostly strike and I'm dead.

 

[Cornface]

Just wait till you get to level 70. The rogues are the most powerful class in the game at the moment, with no anti-class at all.

 

[Husky]

Fire isn't necessairly better for leveling. Sure you do more initial damage, but with frost you can get some great shatter combo's later on (especially with Ice Lane although that's much later). Plus Frost has much greater CC than fire.

But, to each his own. Whatever works best for you.

 

[Dakho]

Don't worry about anything until endgame in terms of balance, because it's constantly changing and is for the most part unimportant. At 70 both mages and rogues have ways to defend themselves against one another.

 

[Squll2]

Just wait till you get to level 70. The rogues are the most powerful class in the game at the moment, with no anti-class at all.

S4 spriest > S4 rogue(any spec)

T6 spriest > S4 rogue(any spec)

S4 retpally > S4 rogue(any spec)

T6 ret pally > S4 Rogue(any spec)

S4 demonlogy warlock > S4 rogue(any spec)

T6 demonlogy warlock > T6 rogue(any spec)

 

[Cornface]

S4 spriest > S4 rogue(any spec)

T6 spriest > S4 rogue(any spec)

S4 retpally > S4 rogue(any spec)

T6 ret pally > S4 Rogue(any spec)

S4 demonlogy warlock > S4 rogue(any spec)

T6 demonlogy warlock > T6 rogue(any spec)

You are kidding me right? First of all, that ain't classes, that is speccs. Second, Have you played any arena lately, it seems you have no clue how it works.

 

[Ashcat]

Rogues are just rolling in the OPness right now. Go find a warrior or something and kill him.

 

[Seannny]

I love this whole Overpowered stuff.

See ingame, Everyone says Hunters and locks are OP...
On the WoW Forums, Everyone says its locks and Druids.. BUT ONLY RESTO DRUIDS!!!
On here, you guys say its rogues...

Now lets do it, same as underpowered.

Ingame people think Shamans and Rogues are underpowered/Broken
On the WoW forums, people say Paladins and Mages are extremely Underpowered.
On here, well i havent seen Underpowered said yet.

lol, i love point of view, dont you guys?

 

[Cornface]

No, it just seems that you haven't played enough high-end PvP the realize the situation.

 

[Seannny]

No, it just seems that you haven't played enough high-end PvP the realize the situation.

Ive played enough high end pvp
I have played arena, No im not the best, but i do know how it works
and yeah ive played battlegrounds, etc...

Besides im not stating my opinion on this, my opinion is this:

If every class complains they are underpowered then everyone is balanced.
All i was stating was what ive seen and heard people say.

 

[NoxMortus]

I would like to quote this from Zechs on SK Gaming;

'Firstly, if my race is the weakest and I win, how good am I? Not only did I win, but I won with the crappiest race! Secondly, in a similar fashion, it’s also the perfect excuse for losing. You didn’t out-play me; you just have a stronger race. Playing the underdog soothes our ego and lessens the pain of defeat.'

He's talking about wc3 but it can be applied here aswell

 

[Cornface]

Ive played enough high end pvp
I have played arena, No im not the best, but i do know how it works
and yeah ive played battlegrounds, etc...

Besides im not stating my opinion on this, my opinion is this:

If every class complains they are underpowered then everyone is balanced.
All i was stating was what ive seen and heard people say.

Yeah, but not all classes are complaining, that's the thing. There is just this great unbalance in WoW atm, and I am talking about the melee vs caster in PvP, and it's just the casters who are complaining because they are underpowered.

 

[Sim]

I would like to quote this from Zechs on SK Gaming;

'Firstly, if my race is the weakest and I win, how good am I? Not only did I win, but I won with the crappiest race! Secondly, in a similar fashion, it’s also the perfect excuse for losing. You didn’t out-play me; you just have a stronger race. Playing the underdog soothes our ego and lessens the pain of defeat.'

He's talking about wc3 but it can be applied here aswell

Zechs well summarized it up here. Humans hate losing and so they do what they can to lessen it up.

 

[Seannny]

Yeah, but not all classes are complaining, that's the thing. There is just this great unbalance in WoW atm, and I am talking about the melee vs caster in PvP, and it's just the casters who are complaining because they are underpowered.

Im not sure what you mean... Casters really arent underpowered...

I hope you dont mean warlock.. Becuase if were on the subject of stronger classes, Warlock leads it.

If you mean the mage? Then no, The mage is the class with the most escape abilitys. Yes its not damage dealing unless your fire and thats not the best cookie cutter spec, But still the mage has survivability with ice.

If you cant shaman as a caster, then no shaman are fine as well, Shaman are in one of there most balanced times actually. and are pretty kickass at pve.

If you mean the priest? no the priest is doing very well right now also. The priest has a lot of survivability and is extremely useful as a support class... You've got to remember that a priest isnt a damage dealer. Unless your shadow specced, and even then its not an amazing DPS...

Druids probably could use a bit less resto and a bit more balance to even things out, thats coming in the expansion. they are probably the only class that is better. But the resto druid cant kill, they survive. They kill you by wearing you down, casters out of mana, etc...

As blizzard stated " The game is NOT based on 1v1 or 2v2. The game is based more around 3v3 and 5v5 odds. "

So if you claim a class overpowered because they are rocking the 2's in arena... well thats pretty innacurate, probably becuase its a whole new game 1 on 1 or with friends to help you out.

 

[Cornface]

Im not sure what you mean... Casters really arent underpowered...

Err, what class are you playing? Warlocks are extremely unbalanced atm, and that is because they can slaughter casters so easy, but yet are so weak against melee it is pathetic. Their pets die in 2-3 hits by a good geared warrior/rogue. Mages, well I haven't played mage in many months now, but they are one of the most underpowered class at the moment.

But yes, I agree with you on the shaman/priest part, they are rather balanced at the moment. And druids, that is a joke right? Druids is the most strongest class in the game atm in 1v1 and 2v2, but like you said, this game isn't balanced around that.

No, the main problem is that melee damage dealers (mainly rogues and warriors) are so extremely overpowered at the moment. And that is for 3 reasons as I see it;

1. Their gear scales A LOT better than caster gear.
Let me give an example
A warlock with full S2 and a warlock with full S4, not that big difference.
A warrior with full S2, and a warrior with S4, ENORMOUS DIFFERENCE. Warriors does suck more the worse gear they have, but lets face it. In high-end pvp, there is no shitty-geared warriors.

2. Melees can use PvE gear without loosing much survivability. It might actually give them more. Their damage output is so damn much higher, I mean a rogue with dual war glaives, tier 6 BT/sunwell gear. That is freaking ouch. But a warlock or mage in tier 6 gear is weak, why? Because they need all the resilience and hp they can get in order to survive the onslaught from rogues and/or warriors. But Rogues got so damn many escaping ability, it's just a big joke. But we've seen some difference here actually, Blizzard started nerfing Cheat Death. It's not that much, but it's a start.

3. Armor Penetration. This is not that big, just unfair. Armor is a great defense against melees, and it gives them hell. But now there is rogues with about 2k-3k armor penetration, and that is what clothers has in armor, which reduces their armor to what? Yes, Zero. And that increases their damage with about 20 % if I am not mistaken. And heck, what do have? Spell Penetration. Hah! How much help is that really? Some, maybe. In certain situations, but lets face it, very few people have high resistance.

 

[Seannny]

No way you can look at me with a straight face and say warlocks are UNDERPOWERED.

Warlocks can kill any class in the game right now. having difficulty maybe with only the rogue. But thats the counter class.. A lot of that has to do with Fear, a warrior on your ass? fear it to hell. Game over. Rogues not much to say here, other than Rock breaks scissors, As for warriors overpowered i wouldnt say much so. They suck eggs alone, and without any healer they aren't guaranteed a win with any class. Note: Use my word choice Guaranteed Lightly...
As For rogues they could deffinetly use some balancing, Paladins and warriors seem to have a better chance at killing them than most, mainly paladin with their bubble. So yeah rogues are a bit on the tough side, but that doesnt mean buff everyone, It means nerf rogues.

 

[Cornface]

No way you can look at me with a straight face and say warlocks are UNDERPOWERED.

Warlocks can kill any class in the game right now. having difficulty maybe with only the rogue. But thats the counter class.. A lot of that has to do with Fear, a warrior on your ass? fear it to hell. Game over. Rogues not much to say here, other than Rock breaks scissors, As for warriors overpowered i wouldnt say much so. They suck eggs alone, and without any healer they aren't guaranteed a win with any class. Note: Use my word choice Guaranteed Lightly...
As For rogues they could deffinetly use some balancing, Paladins and warriors seem to have a better chance at killing them than most, mainly paladin with their bubble. So yeah rogues are a bit on the tough side, but that doesnt mean buff everyone, It means nerf rogues.

Wasn't meant to say underpowered, mistake from my side. I mean unbalanced because they suck so hard vs melees and slaughter casters. Fear warriors, this is a joke, correct? In arenas they will blow their fear immune CDs giving you maybe 1 fear per minute if lucky, and that usually gets dispelled.
And warriors doesn't suck alone, sure their main power is in having a healer with them, and they do in the arenas. I am talking from an arena perspective here.

 

[Seannny]

Well if i were playing with a warlock, i would do my best to keep the warrior off the warlock, so the warlock could fear... Seeing as the cooldown for fear is what... 6 seconds? XD But i guess thats not the point, Alone warlocks do have issues against melee i suppose... But i know plenty of warlocks who are stopped by nothing. A lot of warlocks dunno shit about their pet and what to do with it, if they were smart they wouldnt try and be cool and use the felgaurd but use the tank one and just sacrafice it when they needed to get a fear off. Because once you get feared, your pretty much locked in and its game over. Especially if your in arena and your partner is down. however if we are talking 2's then youll be up against loads of Warriors and druids and that team is practically unbeatable...

Warlocks demolishing casters is pretty okay, as long as warlocks have their counter class. The paper to their rock. and if its melee so be it, thats what blizz was going for. As for Druids, the only thing overpowered is Resto. and if they nerf that it will somehow indirectly Fuck over the class PVE. So blizz has been holding back for that very reason.

Currently i really see only 2 Overpowered classes, The Warlock and the Druid. all the other classes can be beat. Rogues are overpowered all the way to 70. then once you get your trinkets from arena and stuff, when you have the honor all grinded, you will be able to trinket out of the proper Stun and the rogues done for... Hell i play a rogue and i can tell you exactly which stun i always am hoping doesnt miss or get resisted.