WC3Banlist?

[DM Cross]

Correction, Ryoko:

Alexander - 1
Ryoko - 2
Banlist - 0

Alexander

 

[SD_Ryoko]

Alexander - 1
Ryoko - 3?
Banlist - 0

// Dota Allstars 6.06.w3x : PWNT

 

[DM Cross]

OH MY GODDESS, RYOKO, HOW DID YOU DO THAT, IT SEEMS SO BLOODY HARD!

...Really -.-

Alexander
That was sarcasm, btw...

 

[....]

No point arguing with people who wont listen or see others points of view... If you really believe what youre doing isnt lame as all hell, and want others to believe that you got banned for shit that didnt happen (basically lying your ass off), then I have no reason to respect your opinion and would say the program works- because I wont have to worry about getting you in my games

 

[DM Cross]

SD_Ryoko has exceeded their stored private messages quota and can not accept further messages until they clear some space.

The message I was trying to send, edited for content:

// Sorry alex.

Alexander

 

[SD_Ryoko]

Okay alex, we've been mean enough. I dont think he noticed the map.

..., its not like your team went out of your way to listen to us either.

The whole point is, there are no 'BNET' police, and trying to force people to be or play a certain way just isn't practical.

It may be lame as hell, of course. I never said it wasn't. But, the game lets you do it. It lets you use furion. How does that make it wrong? You can add people to as many lists as you like; I'm not a horrible guy because I did something in the game.

Surely, its better than the people who talk shit all game, and insult you. The people who get lucky, gang you 5 on 1, then call you a noob, just to see if it makes you angry.

 

[DM Cross]

About that last post:

Don't be sorry Ryoko, I just couldn't think of another way to grab your attention because your PM box was full. I myself am sorry if I voliated any rules, regardless of the intentions behind the actions.

Alexander

 

[SD_Ryoko]

Its hard not to feel passionately about it - I know I do. Have to check myself sometimes - LOL.

 

[DM Cross]

Hmm, I think the real heart of the matter (BTW, notice Mister ... ran off?) is this:

Does this clan that worked so hard to make such a popular map hold the right to say who plays or who does not?

Now, just to play Devil's Advocate (argue both sides), here are some points:

These people put a lot of time and effort into this map, and it's versions.
It's very popular, so that means people are going to want to steal it and call it their own.
B.Net IS a comminuty where we're all supposed to be free to play whatever games we choose.
However, the host DOES have a say in who they let play or not.
Also however: Is it fair to restrict gameplay when the game itself does not do this?
If so, then why create the things that create these "cheating" problems?

Alexander
Just my thoughts

 

[....]

No one said you were a horrible guy, and yes, weve considered adding a do not allow teleport here option with the trigger, but voted against it because he may need to teleport there when his team IS there. If you think its lame as hell, why even do it dude? Ganking someone 5v1 is part of the game- its not ruined, you simply revive, and stay together if thats how its being played. Having furion TP in and make treants CAN ruin a game. Why dont you think that the team which outplayed the other should win? If you had any skill in DotA (not meant to be a flame), you wouldnt need to do that shit to win,- and you wouldnt stoop that low so you could win. Doing stuff like that makes you no better than the people who do gank and call you noob. Ill put it this way: Tiny can toss people into a revine that they cant possibly escape from. The game lets you do it, but you must remain there the rest of the game, and cannot escape. Is that right? Just because you can do something doesnt mean its the right wya to play. Yea, sure youre more likely to win if they have a player who cant play, but common decency should prevail, and you shouldnt do that. Banlist is an effective tool for keeping people who dont have that common decency out of my games. It works, plain and simple. You cant refute its effectiveness, both as a deterrant, and a preventative measure for future games. Just because you got banned for something which can ruin a game doesnt mean the program doesnt work- infact, it does the opposite! Owell, Ive said my peace. The program says more than I can ever get through to you guys through logic, so download it, become educated about it, and you will drop this based on the sheer amount of misinformation involved.

 

[SilverHawk]

This doesn't look like it's going anywhere; nobody has switched sides. Let's all try to let it go.

 

[SD_Ryoko]

Well, sorry, I'll probobly never agree.

Rhasta can cyclone you and plop wards down on your shadow, and its instant death.

Yet you refuse to change that. The 'pro' players call it 'skillz' and say 'deal with it', and I'm tired of it. If you say you can't, I can give you more trigger code.

Rules and 'IMBA's are decided in your favor.

Backdooring with furion takes hero timing, creep timing, and 'skillz' to make it really work well. Half the time, they wait for you to come of course. I get banned, Rhasta does not.

Furion doesn't ruin the game. You have to hit one tower or one rack five times to get it. Its just ANNOYING, and thats why people get angry.

When they get angry, it makes it more interesting. A big grin. Where should I tele next? Are they waiting for me? Hee heeeeeee.

 

[SilverHawk]

I agree too, but it doesn't look like he's going to change his mind. Has anyone filed a formal complaint to Blizzard?

 

[....]

Hawk, dont waste your time. It does not violate EULA or even reach the internet/battle.net. The activity is based on what computers connect to yours when someone joins your game. lol there are people like shadowfrench out there whose sole purpose is to violate the EULA and cheat in NON custom games. If they wont do anything about him, why would they bother with a program thats 1) benign, 2) for customs 3) doesnt violate EULA and 4) doesnt give a player an unfair advantage?
Report all you want, but dont expect any action. This really is pointless, I dont need to do shit like that to win, so Ill stick by the rules and just have fun- and not have my opponents hate me
Cya

 

[SilverHawk]

If you find it indecent I simply just don't think it should be in the game. That's all I'm saying in this thread. Ever.

 

[RoT-Sfan]

Right or wrong?

I think there is an issue that is being overlooked by those who hate the banlist (I've yet to use it, only seen it being used). The biggest issue is whether it is wrong to ban someone (and possibly have others auto ban them) because they do something you don't approve of (leave, backdoor (against TDA rules, and cheap, definatly ban-worthy), be a general rear-end in the game). The solution is, it isn't. From a very simple logical look :

A: The program is within battle.net EULA rules, and does not break any.
B: The program does not affect the game as supported by battle.net (that is, the ladder games, custom games are NEVER supported by battle.net, but are allowed (which is why the host is always completely removed from battle.net once the game starts).
C: The host chooses to use the program, and how to use it. He has this right, because he is the rightful owner of the machine on which the game is being hosted.
D: No one is forced to play with banlist hosts.
E: Banlists will never take over even 10% of Dota games on battle.net servers, because of lack of interest and/or lack of know-how in using the program.

I don't see what the complaining is about. I'm about to start using Banlist right now. You may play the game however you want, but you shouldn't expect everyone to like it. You pick your host, he doesn't pick you, so don't forget that simple point (it is always an active decision by you to join a game with banlist running).

RoT-Sfan (Azeroth)

 

[DM Cross]

Well, here's something I don't get about this. It SOUNDS LIKE (but I may be mistaken) that if a person finds a glitch or bug in the game, and they exploit it, they're banlisted... Well, I can UNDERSTAND why you wouldn't want them to play that game, but still, why don't you FIX the bug, instead of just adding people to the list when they use the bug? Naturally word of a bug in a popular game is going to get around, and naturally people are going to take advantage of it if they get the chance. Why bother giving them that chance?

So, in short, it seems to me that you guys are either too lazy to fix your own game, or too full of yourselves to change it, and allow people who USED to use NO LONGER EXISTING bugs play a BETTER VERSION

But that's just my view of things.

 

[Shadowy Fear]

I second that, Alexander.

The NEED for a banlist shouldn't even have arisen in the First Place -_-.

Backdooring is cheap? THEN FIX IT! Write a simple trigger that won't let Furion TP into the other base unless there are +5 creeps there or +2 heroes!

. . . Ten of these simple triggers could probably remove the reason for a BL altogether.

Don't want people leaving? Create a custom AI script for the remaining players of the person who left, and share control with the rest of the team. Use a timer to make the hero attack move to the enemy base, with a script that checks for certain conditions and makes him use abilities ro run away.

Give people a dynamic code at the end for a good hero.

Create a messed up trigger that crashes the game for someone who tries to leave. Disable the menu and make them run off of arrow keys (LOL)!

\/\/hile the BanList itself isn't really as evil as some have stated here (unless used haphazardly by an angry noob), the CAUSE for it shouldn't have surfaced at all. DotA is a good game, this measure isn't really appropriate. Simply basing the trees off of props would solve the problem. You guys said they were only for aesthetic values . . .

Once again, I'm not directly against the Banlist, but more for the cause of it. No disrespect intended (TM). Thanks.

 

[SD_Ryoko]

I thought this thread was long closed.

I don't like banlist because its a form of control, when its not your right to control.

Everyone on battlenet - in theory - paid to play, just like you.

You can't control how people behave and act online - so you wrote a program that tries to, and still isn't perfect.

I just wrongfully lost the other day - because clinks, furion , AND the stupid wolf backdoored and suicided.

I swear a little and I walk away. I don't get uber angry, and write some kind of program to ban people from playing, and add the whole team off 11 year olds to a banlist, post about how awesome banlist is, thinking I control things that I ultimately, can't.

Blizzard locks down accounts who cheat - people with maphacks and other third party programs.

Blizzard doesn't ban people who teleport somewhere on the map.

Why is this thread open....?