A 3rd-Party DotA; Will it stand a chance?

[TavinG]

DotA itself was a rip off of a custom StarCraft game, so I don't see why this would be a problem. Hell, one could argue that AllStars is a rip off of the original RoC DotA, since the two versions aren't alike at all.

Besides which, there have been a number of DotA-esque maps, including DotA "sequels" like Chaos.

I think the problem with these "failed" maps is that people don't maintain them. The reason DotA is so successful is that it is constantly being updated with new content, play mechanics and balance issues. It keeps the game fresh and relevant.

 

[Arcane]

A really balanced game that takes skill and time to learn will not be played as often as a game where there are a few good heroes and a bunch of crappy ones.

Sad isn't it. There's a way around this though: you make every single hero unbalanced in its own way, so that in the end, they balance each other out. You do this because, face it, you like owning people.

So you should make each hero imbalanced, but also make the map balanced.

 

[Mittsies]

First of all, it's not called "DotA", it's called "AoS".
And yes, it does matter - name it "DotA" and it definitely won't stand a chance.
Also, it wouldn't really be "3rd party" as your "product" wouldn't have anything to do with the specific DotA Allstars map.

Well the original idea was to in fact completely copy DotA Allstars but with my own heroes/items/features, etc. However at this point I'm going to slowly make it more unique until it is nothing like DotA. In the end it will probably still have the same situation of affiliation (Sentinel VS. Scourge) since it has such a nice feel to it, and a lot of the same "base" (non-recipe) items, because they fit so well. I don't feel too bad about taking a lot of the base items because many were from Warcraft 3 Melee.

A map that will be played semi-frequently must be simple to learn, whith some type of imbalance that makes certain heroes overpowered.

For example, Aeon of Strife has some INCERDIBLY powerful heroes, while also having some really poor heroes.

A really balanced game that takes skill and time to learn will not be played as often as a game where there are a few good heroes and a bunch of crappy ones. It's true in other games as well. In SSBM there are only a few characters people commenly play for tournament. In Soul Calibur 3 there are only 3 common tournament characters. In Marval vs. Capcom 2 there are only a few common heroes that can do infinate loops.

Meanwhile, games like Guilty Gear: Accent Core are hidden from the spotlight while having better play and much more balance.

I can say now that my game will not, and most likely never be "perfectly" balanced. However my good friend David who is a harsh critic about everything and anything, including anything I do, actually admitted this at one point.

"Wow. You should really make your heroes less balanced. It's creepy.."

Sadly, as more heroes are added, this fact may change. Hopefully the with enough input from others my game will be very closely balanced.

 

[SFilip]

> completely copy DotA Allstars but with my own heroes/items/features
In that case you would be hitting a lose-lose situation for your map: people who like DotA Allstars wouldn't play it because it's a ripoff of a map they like and people who don't like it wouldn't play it because it would look too much like the map they don't like.
If you're making an AoS map, make sure it has absolutely nothing to do with DotA Allstars (or any other AoS map for that matter).
Be unique. Why Night Elf versus Undead? Why Orcs versus Humans? Why not Furbolgs versus Trolls for instance?
Why combining items/recipes? Why have permanent items at all? Why not just limit yourself to potions and scrolls?

 

[Darkchaoself]

Why not Furbolgs versus Trolls for instance?

Sorry for off topic, but that would be sick!

 

[Sooda]

Thought you meant by 3rd party game a standalone totally new game with models and so. Because of that I voted yes. Though it sounds different form DotA still - Capture the Flag element makes it different.

 

[Uberplayer]

What I think is that you can no longer get your map over DotA anymore, it's too late. There are all kind of leagues and money tournaments already, so it really is too late. And also, you would get flamed by this dota community, and most of the wc3 players are dota players.

And as SFilip already said, it should not look like DotA, not feel like DotA, not sound like DotA. It should be something completely different.. with some unique gameplay and some neat little features.

I give shot to a any game as long as it fulfils my needs.

 

[duyen]

> completely copy DotA Allstars but with my own heroes/items/features
In that case you would be hitting a lose-lose situation for your map: people who like DotA Allstars wouldn't play it because it's a ripoff of a map they like and people who don't like it wouldn't play it because it would look too much like the map they don't like.
If you're making an AoS map, make sure it has absolutely nothing to do with DotA Allstars (or any other AoS map for that matter).
Be unique. Why Night Elf versus Undead? Why Orcs versus Humans? Why not Furbolgs versus Trolls for instance?
Why combining items/recipes? Why have permanent items at all? Why not just limit yourself to potions and scrolls?

I limited myself to scrolls in my map. (Ancient Wars)

But I think perSona is probably the most unique AoS out there.

 

[Flare]

I would play it, because I often find fun maps by playing something that I would usually just look away from and immediately assume it sounds crap before playing (Seelenjagd would be a great example for me).

btw anman, i thought your map was ancient battle, not ancient wars

 

[duyen]

Ah, your right. I actually made 2 maps though, 1 called Ancient Battle, 1 called Ancient Wars.

 

[Mittsies]

If you're making an AoS map, make sure it has absolutely nothing to do with DotA Allstars (or any other AoS map for that matter).
Be unique. Why Night Elf versus Undead? Why Orcs versus Humans? Why not Furbolgs versus Trolls for instance?
Why combining items/recipes? Why have permanent items at all? Why not just limit yourself to potions and scrolls?

At that point I'd literally be forcing my game not to be DotA; but I guess that's what it comes down to. I will definitely need to start generating tons of ideas to give players who DO like DotA a new outlook on the game, and players who DON'T like DotA a whole different experience in general.